Re: Files for the first phase of Czech translation of documentation

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Re: Files for the first phase of Czech translation of documentation

John Mandereau
Hi Pavel,

Francisco has already replied to you while I was writing this, so the
reply about the node name issue w.r.t. cases in Czech is just a
rewording of his last reply.

Il giorno dom, 19/09/2010 alle 15.36 +0200, Pavel Fric ha scritto:
> I send the files in attachment. The .po file was sent already before.
> The template was taken from German translation files, so I didn't
> handle with the structure of files, only translated texts in German
> language.

Are you sure the German template is up to date?  It's good to see what
other translations do to give you some idea by examples, but it's better
to start from docs in English, using template generation tools explained
in the Contributors' Guide, even if these are not perfect.  As the docs
maintenance and development is English-speaking-centric, and it would be
very hard to change this development model, I'd rather not take files
from a language other than English, or if I did I would carefully check
that the translation was up-to-date at last release on
http://lilypond.org/doc/v2.13/Documentation/web/translated.html


> I have one question. There are lines with:
>
>
> @ref{Textový vstup}
> @unnumberedsec Textový vstup
> @translationof Text input

I guess you mean "@node Textový vstup" instead of "@ref{Textový vstup}"
here.


> and on other place:
>
> @ref{Textovém vstupu}
>
> "Text input" in braces is in the first case translated in the
> nominative (1. pád), but in the second case in ablative or say
> locative (6. pád)
>
> Does it matter? This "problem" - difference between text strings in
> braces is only on some places, not all. The solution would be somehow
> change the syntax of statement, or force nominative, even if the
> beauty of language would suffer.
There is a way to respect cases by defining a value of the third
argument of @ref command as the text you'd like to make appear, whereas
the first argument to @ref command should always be the exact node name
so that a dummy computer program can find where the node was defined,
that is you should write @ref commands like (note the two commas)

@ref{NODE_NAME_AS_DEFINED,,NODE_NAME_AS_IT_SHOULD_READ}

e.g. in the example you give

@ref{Textový vstup,,Textovém vstupu}

This way of doing things means extra work for you, and it's only up to
you (and other Czech translators for LilyPond if any) to decide whether
to use correct cases to node names in cross-references.  If you decide
to do so, macros used for cross-references to other LilyPond manuals
(@ruser @rlearning etc.) may need this kind of treatment as well, I'll
explain you how in case you have decided to use correct cases.

All the best,
John

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Re: Files for the first phase of Czech translation of documentation

John Mandereau
Le lundi 20 septembre 2010 à 19:21 +0200, Pavel Fric a écrit :
> thanks for answer, so the e-mail adress, I sent the files is good for
> translation issues and I will send the answers there, not directly to
> developers. :-)

Great, then welcome on translators' list!


> I think, that I am the only one in this moment, who cares about
> bringing LilyPond to Czech language. I´ve already worked on
> lilypond.po hosted on Translation Project, but probably due to
> unchanged header - it tells, that it is LilyPond in version 1.6 or so
> - also it is not loaded by LilyPond to project, because of this
> misunderstanding (the file was completed to current version just
> before one year. Then I am working regularly on Frescobaldi for abou
> one year and half.

Please let me a few days to look at this.


> > http://lilypond.org/doc/v2.13/Documentation/web/translated.html
>
> Yes, I think.

No, according to that page, the German translation is not completely
up-to-date.  Unless it is much harder for you to read English than
German (say, it takes you 10 times longer to read and understand it), i
highly recommend you to folow the sources in English for translating,
and only refer to German docs as an additional source.


>  and when I am not much skilled in texinfo structure and commands, I
> am still not much experienced, I can, using German files, just focus
> on translation.

I don't understand this: why couln't you do this starting from English
docs as well?  As a starting point, you can just ignore the Texinfo
commands and translate the plain text, and you learn them as you need,
asking for unclear details on translations list as you need.  It's
normal that Texinfo code puzzles you at the beginning, but don't worry,
it will go smoothly after some experience.


> Yes, it is. Thanks for manual how to deal with it. I am interested in
> all, what you can offer. If I understand, I only have to add
> "nominative" on proper places and two commas. The I ask you for manual
> how to deal with definitions in "macro" file.

Sure.  Would you like to resubmit files th after having corrected this?
If you decide to use correct cases in cross-references (and remember
that you don't have to, it's your choice), then please do it in all the
documentation and website, for the sake of coherence.

Best,
John